FIVE fire service workers who were disciplined after an investigation into porn emails are to appeal.
Two of them, watch manager, Mark Sapple, based at the brigade's training centre in Manchester city centre, and firefighter Christopher Moss, who works at Stalybridge, were sacked.
They were both dismissed for forwarding pornographic material.
Demoted
Eleven other officers were disciplined for passing on 'inappropriate' material of an adult nature. Of those, three are appealing after all were demoted. They are a senior manager at Rochdale Borough headquarters who was demoted to firefighter and two other members of staff based at fire service HQ in Pendlebury who have been demoted one rank.
Peter Taylor, brigade secretary of the Fire Brigades Union, confirmed that five staff would be appealing but said: “It would not be appropriate to comment further as the process has not concluded.”
It is understood that all five will be arguing that the punishments they were given were too harsh.
The appeals are likely to be heard before Christmas and the brigade's new County Fire Officer Steve McGuirk or another senior officer are likely to hear them.
The investigation began when Mr Sapple and Salford-based community safety officer Jan Finch were suspended for allegedly sending an 'inappropriate' email.
Mrs Finch allegedly sent the email to Mr Sapple which included a graphic image with a humorous caption of an unknown woman with a body piercing.
Mr Sapple is then said to have forwarded it to other people.
Formal complaint
Among those who allegedly received it was a woman member of the brigade's staff. As she looked at it, a senior officer who was standing by her also saw it and decided to make a formal complaint to management.
The suspensions triggered a lengthy inquiry in which emails Mr Sapple and Mrs Finch had allegedly sent were traced to other officers, whose emails were also examined and it was claimed further, even more graphic, material was discovered.
Mrs Finch has been given a final written warning.
Five other staff based at brigade HQ have been given a final written warning, and one a written warning. An officer based in Salford, has also received a written warning.
A brigade spokesman said: “It would be inappropriate for us to comment on this matter as the appeals have yet to be heard.”
Porn email firefighters launch appeal
November 23, 2009
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Showing comments 1 to 22 and replies | View All
rocketmanu, Ex Old Trafford (23/11/2009 at 12:21)
Mad Welsh Scotsman, Cadishead (23/11/2009 at 12:46)
A Manc and blue (23/11/2009 at 16:08)
to the point, bury (23/11/2009 at 17:01)
umpire 2, Salford M7 4HT (23/11/2009 at 17:47)
We stop people after a laugh and criticise them when they do and then we protect those who commit crime and harassment because we are scared to upset them and make their life than it is already.
northred, prestwich (23/11/2009 at 19:30)
we dont need thought police we need firefighters
this brave new world isnt very pleasant is it
Chris Shelmerdine , Hulme. (23/11/2009 at 21:13)
bitterandtwisted exsquaddiecop (23/11/2009 at 21:25)
In a few years time, we`ll all be politically correct robots.
A Bus Driver (24/11/2009 at 09:15)
Johhnyboy2308, Dukinfield (24/11/2009 at 09:42)
Trev Miles (24/11/2009 at 11:38)
Justice I reckon.
to the point, bury (24/11/2009 at 12:35)
I take it that you are are not a fire fighter, dont forget Orwells book, all the workers, mindless, marching, doing there masters bidding.
Get a life,this guy may save yours one day.
Of Denton, Tameside (24/11/2009 at 16:22)
Angelene19, Manchester (24/11/2009 at 19:10)
SAFs RedKnight, Manchester (24/11/2009 at 19:39)
robert meredith (25/11/2009 at 08:30)
KevinK (25/11/2009 at 16:32)
Jean Ashworth (25/11/2009 at 20:24)
I am disappointed that the headline refers to "Porn" email as according to the first report on the 28th October investigated by the Police this was not the case as it stated that "None of the material was illegal "?
I feel far to an heavy hand has landed on these young firefighters and I wish them well in thier appeals and hope common sense prevails as it is not just them who are suffering it is thier families as well and lets not forget they have chosen a career to save lives which often means putting thier own in danger.
Councillor Jean Ashworth
Hannanna, Ex-Hyde (26/11/2009 at 04:16)
ff (26/11/2009 at 08:09)
Just for your information, the majority of the people involved with this situation were/are NON-OPERATIONAL ie they do not ride a fire engine. They work office hours in basically specialist admin roles. Operational firefighters don't get time to scratch themselves these days as we are so busy going out fitting smoke alarms and carrying out inspections etc.
In my humble opinion yes they did wrong, BUT the punishment doesn't fit the crime.
Trev Miles (27/11/2009 at 15:49)
As for whether these guys are heroes or firemen or pen pushers that is irrelevant. Would one consider it acceptable if an MP or Civil Servant did it? Either way the guilty parties were not employed to send offensive material via their employer's computer system - they will have signed agreements to reflect this and have subsequently ignored those agreements.
The availability of the internet and offensive material is no excuse. Would it be acceptable to show a 'porn mag' around the office. No, of course not and this is the same thing.
It may seem harsh, but consider all the facts we know and just accept the Brigade performed a thorough 4 month investigation.
kaleel khan (06/12/2009 at 20:38)
What I would like to ask is
Was there a fair and honest investigation undertaken?
Who was involved in carrying out this investigation?
What experienced does HR have in dealing with such cases? Hr are the people that need to protect staff and ensure a fair process under the equality legislation is carried out and not supporting the conviction of such case until clear evidence to suggest that such practice was carried out continuity across the board.
What do you mean by inappropriate images?
What do you mean by pornographic images?
Are all involved being judged the same or are they being punished because you want to make a stand.
I hear the fire authority are making cut backs? Is this the correct way of getting rid of staff? by finding minor faults.
Please please ensure that firemen are not punished because of a minor mistake or a lack of judgement. We are all humans. The most important thing is we make mistakes but we learn from them. There are a lot of people upset about this and the public need to know the truth. The truth about a fair investigation process and also the findings of this report this to be made public.
I suspect there is a lot of cover up and improper investigation that has been carried out in trying to convict people of wrong doing inorder to get rid of members of the highest workforce.