THE founders of rebel club FC United have warned Manchester United their hard core support is being eroded.
While 'big' United have a weekend off ahead of their do-or-die trip to Chelsea on April 29, the club spawned as a direct result of Malcolm Glazer's controversial Old Trafford takeover are preparing for the biggest day in their own short history.
With all under-18s being admitted free, there is every indication FC United will again shatter the North West Counties League attendance record at Gigg Lane on Saturday, when Great Harwood Town are the visitors.
The attraction is not the actual football but the presentation of the Division Two trophy and the chance to engage in some mutual backslapping after an astonishing debut campaign.
Launched from the shell of an idea initially raised in response to Rupert Murdoch's attempts to buy United in 1998 and constructed in less than two months, in some senses, FC United are the biggest story of the season.
Average attendances of just under 3,000 - with a peak of 4,328 for the January visit of Winsford - mean match-day interest in 'little' United not only eclipses that of every other non-league club in the north-west but some established Football League outfits as well, including their landlords Bury.
Surprise
It would be a major surprise if, in 12 months' time, the FC United phenomenon was preparing to sweep through the Unibond League, and, while the fledgling club will not be permitted to play in the FA Cup next year, a tilt at the FA Vase will be attempted and who is to argue the club will not be one of the first to grace Wembley's magnificent arch.
Ten miles down the road at Old Trafford, the response to FC United's success ranges from grudging respect to outright hostility. Either way, the men who launched the new club are convinced they are having an effect on their mammoth neighbour.
"I am not naive enough to think David Gill is looking at us wondering what we are doing right and he is doing wrong but I do hope it is registering that Manchester United's hard-core support is being eroded," said Jules Spencer, formerly chairman of the Independent Manchester United Supporters' Association and a founder member of FC United.
"United is run by accountants. As long as they are filling the stadium, they won't be bothered by 4,000 of us watching non-league football.
"But the signs are, within a couple of years, it will hit their radar because it is the hard-core element within any club's supporter base who will stand by them when they are not being successful."
In defending himself against charges of hypocrisy - accepting the Glazer shilling after previously decrying the American's business plan as 'too aggressive' - Gill questioned why he should be forced to give up working for the club he has supported all his life, in turn querying how FC United's followers and just give up on the Red Devils and turn their allegiance somewhere else.
The truth is, they haven't. They still follow Manchester United with a passion. They just do it from a distance.
"I am still a United fan and I hope people still look upon me as such," said Spencer.
"I just prefer to spend my Saturdays in a slightly different manner than I used to.
Weird
"It is a weird feeling because I want the team to do well but I feel so much resentment towards the people running the club.
"When they were knocked out of Europe there was the torn emotion of acute sadness at your team getting knocked out of the Champions League but part of you was thinking 'I wonder if this can affect Glazer's business plan and speed up his exit'. It is difficult to reconcile the two situations in your mind."
Spencer has vowed not to set foot inside Old Trafford until Glazer has gone and his pre-season intention to watch at least one away game had to be abandoned as his commitment to FC United started to eat into his time.
If the past 12 months are anything to go by, those plans will have to be shelved again next season as the most high-profile example of a supporter-run club in England goes from strength to strength.
"The speed of FC United's growth has taken us all by surprise," said Spencer.
"We knew there was an appetite for something like this but never could we have envisaged attracting 4,300 to a game.
"We are not claiming the moral high ground in any sense. We exist to provide people with an alternative, either to Malcolm Glazer or the escalating cost of tickets which is pricing so many families out of the Premiership.
"The key thing is, in everything we do, the supporters will have their say. Nothing, from deciding whether to have a sponsors name on a shirt, to the existence of the club, will be done without their agreement."
Do you think United's hard core support is being eroded? Have your say.
Comments
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It certainly is ! , for a club like FC United to be even thought about in the late eighties was unthinkable and we were bottom half most of the time. The Club is just not interested in the hardcore local fans who would turn up even if the club ended up in a mess like Forest or Sheff Wed are in now. Manchester United Football Club or should I now say Business! is only interested in Money, Money and more money, Glazer arriving has made the situation even worse, people say Glazer wants Utd to be successful... course he does so he can make more money! but at what price? he is eroding the hardcore support definately..if there were 76000 turning up every week who sat down in their newly purchased megastore garments and didn't utter a single word in anger then glazer and the board would be delighted. Its getting too expensive for me now and the atmosphere is absolutley dire,, time to go and watch the reds in the pub with the lads from now on.
Well Gill and Ferguson are clearly rattled. And when people actually check the price rises at OT, along with hikes in car parking, catering, programmes etc, are much higher than the spin put out by OT, if not this coming season, then certainly similar big hikes next year, coupled with FC's continued success, may well see a surge of support for 'little' United. Forza FC
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every game is sold out. even the friendlys against teams like rotherham or celtic or honk kong... MAN UTD is unbreakable so STOP US IF YOU CAN!
FC united is just something like Scarborough FC but everyone knows them because of US&A. so RIP FCUM! WE ARE NOT AFRAID OF YOU! Good luck to you!
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dream on! FC Who-nited will go broke before they become anwhere near a fraction of the success of the Giant that is Man Utd. so what if FC Who-nited dominated the bottom league in the country will the continue to do so next season. and the season after. people will loose interest when United have got the midfield back and have won the Title back no one will care about the muppets at Gigg Lane.
The arrogance of these ex-fans makes me sick. How dare they call themselves 'hard core' supporters. Real 'hard core' fans would never have deserted their team, no matter what. I may live in Dallas now but I am, and always have been a Manchester United supporter.
The only thing these folk at F.C. are doing is constantly trying to undermine the team they say they support, by either making statements to the media or through fanzines like Red Issue, which more and more resembles a Leeds fanzine.
The 'founders' are businessmen now, they're trying to poach other teams fans using incentives like free admission because they've actually lost some support. Give them time, these 'founders' will sell the space on their shirts, they'll raise ticket prices if the rent goes up or the players wnat more money, they'll let sponsors name their stadium, they'll make everyone sit down if the FA tells them to, they'll fire managers for not winning often enough, they'll change kick off times if they're being paid and they'll tour pre season in any country that pays the fee. And they'll still find time to critisize everything from Old Trafford.
They can say what they want, but the real 'hard core' fans will never abandon Old Trafford.
if i wanted to spend my time with students id go to uni
George, Red Tom impressive figures yes, but they said Hardcore supporters. Not customers. Get past the Glazer takeover rubbish, and look at the big picture something like this has been on the cards for a long time. Instead of flippant little jibes why not see this situation as really sad. Yes people left in protest of the takeover, but you'd be surprised at the fans that attend (or choose the Pub) because they've been priced out of following a club.
What a surprise to find the chief FCUM cheerleader JohnnieJohn banging his well worn drum yet again for his poor excuse for a football club.
May I direct you in the direction of people who might be interested, namely some of the disaffected malcontents from the minority fan groups who have hitherto declined the glamour of the fairytale club.
Those of us with real passion and loyalty for our club will not desert it for an experiment in socialist utopia, so why don't you quit playing the same old record.
I have never read so much rubbish.
Lets have some factual reporting for a change.
FCUM pay higher wages, so attract a better quality of player (Players who didnt make it at higher leagues, yet get the same wages). They charge ??7 adult admission when the league average price is ??2.50 adult admission. All other NWCL teams give free admission for kids every week, not just on dates whan United arent playing. They have a pid workforce of a chief Executive (Most football league clubs dont employ one) and a full time paid club secretary (Every other non-league club manges to do this with a voluntear paid only expenses). They play in an all seater stadium, so its not "bck to the 70's terrace days" as they claim.
as for the term "Big United", i have never heared anything so insulting, we all know there is only one United. the likes of jules Spencer and Co. have nothing more than their own self interest and self publicism,thats the underlining reason behind FCUM.
I was born and bred in manchester..my old man was on uniteds books in the 50's for a short time..so i have been a united fan for as long as i can remember. Now i live in the US I can only manage a game every few years.. but a few weeks agao i came over and saw 2 MUFC games and one FC game..What a difference. there was next to no atmosphere at both the games i went to.. we were repeatedly told to sit down , the place was shoddy even uglier than i remembered it and i felt gauged every step of the way. Watching the poor suckers getting fleeced in the mega store made me gag.. so i went to see FC at Gigg lane on a cold rainy day along with 3,000 other nutters.. the atmosphere was brilliant.The football was involving and passionate and i came away feeling like I'd had a great afternoons entertainment.. kind of how i remembered Old Trafford as a kid.. the only thing i thought was a bit disturbing was the FC fans screaming and chanting super hostile slurs towards the opposing team and the officials.. has nobody told these goons that the officals are getting less than ??50 to turn out.. and the players often less than that.. so save your rage for Liverpool and Man Shitty.. better still infuse a little wit into your songs and we can all have a good time..
So red he moved to Dallas...
i started coming in 62/3 with my mates we caught the bus into mcr walked down cross lane with bottle of pop and a bag of chips there were thousands of other kids like us queing up to get in the stretford end. i have brought my kids up to support united and they have been coming with me for the last 17 years. what united need to face up to is where is the next generation of kids coming from? u dont see groups of young kids and teenagers anymore. granted there are kids still coming but with their parents. all the local scallies have been priced out something which united will regret in years to come
Spencer's comments sum it up nicely for me.
A great season for FC and an example of how a club can be run for passion not for profit.
Ok so FC's support goes down and United goes up but they're eroding our support. Go figure eh. Yet another none story backed up by MEN...
well i dont think for 1 minute that any "HARD CORE FAN" would stop suporting MANCHESTER UNITED F.C just because they dont like who runs the club."REAL HARD CORE FANS" support the team through thick and thin through the good times and the bad regardless of whats happening at the club.Those are the "REAL HARD CORE FANS"
FC is about the fans, the local community, players who play for love of the game, not more money than most people earn in a year per match. We are not trying to undermine Man U, but providing everyone the opportunity to watch real football, with an incredible atmosphere for under a tenner. Man U may be a "franchise" FC is a mutual society. And to everyone saying FC are nothing, why waste your time getting so worked up then?
Of course attendances at OT won't fall yet. I'll be interested to see how they fare when football ceases to be an attraction to other than the 'hard-core' supporter; the prawn sandwich brigade may yet move elsewhere. While OT has the atmosphere of a funeral with club stewards and catering staff treating us like anything other than customers some of us who have been watching the Reds for many years (41 in my case)will continue to watch FC when we can, where, win or lose, a great time is had by all.
Are they going to PAY fans to come to watch the pub footie at the next FC match? Make sure you stay drunk or you will realize you are watching crap football. Andy and Adam lost their percieved club influence after their "fan club" was turned into such. The hedge funds are in the process of being refinanced at much lower and manageable rates, OT is having record attendances and who'da thunk it that Man United would be threatening Chealsea this late in the campaign? Next season, the "Red Football" fans will celebrate a Super Bowl and a Champions League Cup in the same year! Red Football till I die (Bucs + United!)
Oh BTW, stop posting this rubbish under the Man United heading. No real fans want to read this rubbish.
There is a very simple but undeniable perimeter to fans going to OT. If you cant afford, you cant have. Simple as. Not just because of the Glazer take over you understand, but for at least a decade now more and more grass roots supporters have been priced out of going. I personally know dozens of these fans that have moved into a United pub culture. They still see themselves as United fans but they just dont go anymore. There is an attitude in some quarters of ??" let the rich pay and we will have a pint instead. They now watch United on TV in the pub with their mates and pint or few. Anyone who dosnt believe me should take a trip around Manchester on a home match day and see for them selves. There fans have of course been replaced by those who can afford and occasional match goers. I think the point Spencer is making is that the loyalty of the more casual supporter has never been tested at OT. At other grounds where the grass roots fans have been priced out and where clubs have had a change in fortune, the terraces are half-empty. Those who want to go cant afford to keep pace with the price hikes and the more casual fans find something else to spend their money on. I would hazard a guess the majority of fans now going to FC games would struggle or be unable to afford to go to OT. The suits at United really should sit up and take notice.
Having attended a few of the FC matches, I find their supporters to be the very naive, ignorant of even basic football and very well-read of the propaganda of the FC United of Bury board and completely ignorant of how normal Man United fans perceive them. I want to address all FC Supporters: You are not martyrs. You are not Rebels. You basically have left your spouse because she got a new boss at her job and replaced her with a two-bit call girl.
pete in dallas; iam a hard core united fan; but now go to f.c united; can't stomach the fact the club has been high jacked by "tourists" that the accountants milk. The fans of my day salford reds are now thin on the ground at o.t and not surprisingly are starting to turn up at f.c. matches; these are the fans that stayed through the 70's and eighties when we were garbage and were behind the fight against murdoch[et al].The fact you now live in dallas says it all really; whereas i stated in manchester despite being in purgatory for 3 years at university and hitching home for the matches. I remain a united fan till i die but in the words of the song won't pay glacer work for sky; i believe this could be the start of a movement that returns football to its roots and real fans where it belongs;" well keep the red flag flying here"!!!
"But the signs are... it will hit their radar because it is the hard-core element who will stand by them when they are not being successful."
Surely its a contradiction to say this, when you are ten miles away watching another team...? Sorry, but i still don't get it.