If these "victims" are members of gangs/organised crime then why the hell should we firstly treat them at the tax payers expense and then use police resources to protect them. They should be left to kill each other. If they survive their injuries they should be disposed of in the manner fitting to their activities.

The choose to jopin gangs and should expect to bear the consequences.

Because we live in a civilised society Colin where everyone has rights, that's why.

Besides, i hardly think the taxes you pay in Stockholm go towards the upkeep of patients in the MRI...

Here here Chris I fullu agree.

Probably what has happened here is that when they finished University they all went for a drink got to discussing there doctorates and things got out of hand.
This sort of thing happens all the time amongst the educated elite.
Never mind, in a week or so they will be back at the University as though nothing has happend.
Or perhaps we should arm them all to teeth put them in a locked enclosure and come back in a few days to see if any of these pillars of society are still alive, with any luck they won't be.

We live in a civilised society? Whilst I would dearly love to agree Chris, we dont! Unfortunatley, too many idots, dealers, users and gang members have well and truely made the streets of Manchester (my home town which I still love) far from civilised!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Also, whilst I agree that everyone has rights, do those rights still apply if you abuse them?

I did consider myself as quite liberal and forgiving, but after my house was robbed on a few occasions, my car vandalised and also being attacked by 4 youths one evening, I no longer am! No one cared about my rights in this so called civilised society when all this happened!

Time to wake up, if they want to live by the sword, let them die by the sword.

To free up police resources, and protect the hospital when police cannot attend in force, responsible people such as doctors should be permitted to carry a pistol. And so should anyone on the front line of today's thuggish society such as A&E staff, and ambulance drivers. And firefighters. And homeowners and motorists and ...etc. In fact, anyone with no criminal record. Criminals can get weapons whatever the law is.
Why disarm the law abiding majority? When private guns have to be obtained illegally, by definition the majority will be in the hands of the less-than-scrupulous. This feeds gun violence.
it's a paradox, but the way to short-circuit a runaway "gun culture" is gun legalization.

Paul, was going to comment on the rubbish you spouted but I'm afraid words have failed me.

The only sensible way to view this story is that the Police are there to protect other patients and the hospital staff should any more of these gun wielding criminals should try and attend the hospital and finish the poor job that they started. I don't for one minute think that the officers on duty care one jot for the well being of these gang members!

Forget civilised society if it were civilised we would all be christian, in my opinion this is the first of many many things to come, street gangs have allways been here from when i was growing u, i say let them kill each other in fact the cops should have shooting schools designed for criminals and gang members so when start shooting they will hit with a kill shot. Sorry but you cant put them in jail because it is still costing us more and more money and of course most of them who get caught want free legal aid so more cost to the tax payer. Or you could just move them to there own city with armed guards patroling the perimetre and let them live as they want just provide them with the basics to live seriously if you think that it is bad now im sure we have seen nothing of whats to come.

Jack, I totally agree! Paul however, I am speachless at such comments..........

The old arguement that anything can be used as weapon is true, however, guns are design for one purpose only. To kill onother living creature. Unlike knives, tools, hammers etc wich were designed for some other purpose and used by the idiotic few as weapons.

Ban guns, full stop! They have no place and no one has a reason to own them (Unless your a game keeper)!

Also if people want to shoot guns, let them own them, however they should pay extra and only be allowed to keep them in a police station or a gun club. Why keep them at home? No place for firearms, just look at the chaos on the streets of New Orleans! Everyone running round with guns in a scared and lawless state.

Wake up or grow up, sorry Paul, get real!

Anyone that wants to own a gun (..or live in a society with them!) should be allowed to do so - but away from everybody else. Preferably somewhere with no food, no water and no resource which is surrounded by an almighty cage. Let them shoot each other - no point anybody else getting involved. Until this happens, all police officers need to be armed (..be it with real guns or tasar guns!)

Jason, I,m not sure what "ban guns, full stop" means. Britain already has the most restrictive gun laws in the world. For example, your suggestion that if people want to shoot guns, they should be able to go to a gunclub would actually mean a relaxing of the current law which bans even that.
Guns exist in Britain and you can't wave a magic wand and make them disappear, not the police, the government, no-one. I would suggest it is you that needs to "get real" on what the limits of the law enforcement authorities are.
The question is, how should the guns be distributed? Concentrated just in the hands of criminals, as they are now?
Finally, I appreciate that there is no chance of gun law being relaxed given that most people's attitude to guns is extremely negative. I do think that much of the hostility is a mere phobia, not based on any real thoughts about what would happen of the law abiding were permitted tools for their own self defence.

Interesting debate with mature comments, I commend all!

Personally I dont have a phobia about firearms, on the contrary. I served for 9 years in the Infantry with a few tours of Northern Ireland, the Balkans and the first Gulf War. I have seen first hand what a firearm can do!

I just cant subscribe or understand why anyone would want or need one?

It also isnt a right (in this country) to own one. The argument about things will get better if we legalise and allow people firearms, is also somthing I cant subscribe too.

I worked in Dallas in Texas, trust me, gun crime is highly prevelant! Far more so than in the UK. Its legal (its expected) to own one there and its a nightmare!

So quick to judge!! the only time you can EVER JUDGE ANYONE!! is when you have walked a mile in there shoes!! nothing is ever so black and white!!

" the hostility is a mere phobia, not based on any real thoughts about what would happen "

Its not often im lost for words, but this individuals comments has left me shaking my head in sheer despair and disbelief.
We all know what guns are capable of, even those that owned guns legally in this country through gun clubs have gone on mindless killing sprees, slaughtering dozens of children and adults alike.
How often do we hear about children in schools in U.S schools being slain by other kids? all to often.

Public gun ownership is the policy of a madman, pure and simple.

The US does have high gun crime. Next door, though, Canada has high gun ownership and much lower gun crime. In Europe, Switzerland has the highest level of private firearms ownership in the world, with pistols freely purchasable by adults. Despite, or rather because of, the fact that firearms are held in almost every home, the criminal use of firearms is so low that it is not even recorded separately in police statistics. Denmark has a similarly high rate of firearms ownership, with most guns completely unregulated. In Belgium private citizens can buy hunting and sporting guns with a readily-granted permit. France, Spain etc are all similar.
All these countries have considerably lower levels of violent crime than the UK.

Jason, thanks for your interesting comments, and thanks also to Jack and Mark, for confirming with their comments that a lot of anti gun attitudes are not particularly well thought out and are more of an irrational prejudice. I have yet to hear a convincing argument against law abiding individuals being allowed to possess firearms under a properly regulated system. I know Jason mentioned there is no "right" to own a gun, that's true. But British law doesn't work like that. It is illegal to own many types of gun, true, but that is a recent law and could be changed. As to why you would want to own a gun, precisely because gun crime, and other violent crimes are going up.
For every burglary, robbery, mugging, rape or other assault, many individuals are frightened to go out at night, some even by day, and often feel fear even in their own homes. This is particularly true of those groups with the smallest degree of real power in our society: old people, people on low incomes, "working class" women and ethnic minorities. It is hardly surprising that the police, short of manpower and resources have long since given up the traditional role of "law enforcement" and have now become professional "evidence gatherers". That's not a problem for the Police, but it does pose a difficulty if you live in an area where you have a lot of crime. So who does the "law enforcement" nowadays? Nobody. That's where widespread ownership of guns comes in. Together with sensible laws on self defence, guns have a habit of cutting through all kinds of complex arguments about the causes of crime. If I try and burgle your home, you might shoot me: that concentrates the mind. It also reduces reliance on the state and it makes people responsible for their own actions. Best of all though, it gives victims a chance against offenders, something they'll never get if they involve the Police. All they do is "gather the evidence." Some commenters here simply want no crime and no guns which is a laudable aim but totally unrealistic. On the one hand we want to ban law-abiding people from having guns, on the other hand it has never been easier for a criminal to obtain an illegal handgun. We worry about thugs and crime and at the same time refuse to give ordinary people the means to defend themselves and their property.

I'll just highlight one point in long list of misinformation and lies that Paul has just come up with.
" If I try and burgle your home, you might shoot me: that concentrates the mind "

No it doesn't, all it means is , i take a bigger gun and more people.
Im sure your stats about other countries are wrong, if i can be bothered ill point them out to you, and the U.K's menatality is totally different to the rest of europe, as proven by our attitude to booze.

One of your other comments "I have yet to hear a convincing argument against law abiding individuals being allowed to possess firearms ", so , the massacres by gun owners that operated under a proper regulated system in this country isn't a convincing arguement ?
You really are void of the thinking process.

Very good comments!! Paul, Bury.

sick all gun crime offenders on an island.... (like alcatraz) and let em shoot it out between thenselves... how can the world not be a better place!

if these so called "morons" were so educated then a debate/discussion would sort the problems they have betwen themselves , not guns

i wouldnt be surprised if the gmp know whos runnin the show in each and every area , but they have no evidence to lock them down,... i do agree with clay. this is the world we live in , nice , innit

i live right in the heart of moss side and i love it. the community, people, location and the cosmopolitan shops.
what annoys me is almost every night i hear gun shots cars screeching, the helicopter or all three.
I dont know who they are personally but i have a fair idea where they hang around as most people do. What worries me is bringing my 3 year old son up amongst this.
i have a well paid job and still can not afford to move out of the area. why should i when my friends and family live here, and every area has its own set of problems but GUNS! thats Scary.
i do see that the police are trying to be pro active but the justice system is no deterrant as in prison these individuals are hero's.

So what are you saying PAUL?
We should all have guns and then everytime come across trouble we can kill them and only the nice people will be left?

i don't understand why people need guns in a country such as this one. can anyone really say what the neccesity for a gun is? and it only seems to be the youth of today that need to possess such weaponary. can we not say that if such individuals are participating in such activities can we not compare these people to terrorists? are they not promoting terrorism within the community they live, as i would assume people would be terrified to leave their homes, due to such activities! i know i would be.

In a nutshell, Great point JoJo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!