THE £3m cost of a huge public consultation exercise on controversial plans for congestion charging in Greater Manchester has been blasted as `too high'.
Coun Susan Williams, leader of Tory-controlled Trafford council which is opposed to the road-toll scheme, told a meeting of local authority leaders the amount seemed `very excessive'.
And she told the meeting of the Association of Greater Manchester Authorities the budget could be reduced if opinion polls were not carried out as part of the exercise. She said it would be `unnecessary' if a referendum was to be held before a final decision was made.
Manchester council leader Sir Richard Leese defended the cost of the consultation exercise saying: "It is a substantial amount of money - the equivalent of 50p per head of the population of Greater Manchester - but we are talking about one of the most significant things ever to have happened in our conurbation.
"Given that we are trying to communicate with a massive number of people, I don't think it is excessive. We have to tell people very clearly what they are being asked about."
He stressed again that at the end of the consultation process there had to be a single decision made.
"My proposition is that at the end of the process we have a referendum and that all 10 Greater Manchester authorities agree in advance to be bound by the result," he said.
If a referendum is held, Sir Richard said he would want the Electoral Commission to be an advisor on the project.
"We would have to show that the exercise is completely independent," he said.
Bury council leader Bob Bibby said he was happy with the idea of a referendum to canvass public views - but not a Greater Manchester one.
Coun Williams said she fully supported the idea of a referendum, but has already said she would want the results broken down borough by borough, and if Trafford voters said no, she would continue to oppose the scheme.
Councillors agreed to discuss the issue fully with their respective authorities and a full discussion on the idea will be held at the next meeting in July.
The AGMA meeting was told that if the pay-to-drive scheme is finally introduced, there was a case for making thousands of private-hire car drivers exempt from road tolls in addition to licensed hackney carriage drivers.
Coun Howard Sykes from Oldham, told the meeting: "In Oldham we have something like 90 hackney drivers but well over 1,000 private hire drivers. Private hire cars are an important part of public transport and should be exempt from paying the toll.
"You are going to be letting yourselves in for a lot of grief otherwise."
The meeting was also told that exempted vehicles should include refuse and waste-carrying vehicles, along with other public service vehicles.
Sir Richard Leese said: "Nothing about the draft plans is written in stone. There are all manner of option which will be thoroughly looked at."
What do you think? Have your say.
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Orb the Impaler, Rochdale (27/06/2008 at 13:50)
First of all there's the U-turn on Manchester's referendum, then the very next day Cambridge shelves it's plans...
Is this sudden attack of cold feet on the part of those who would seek force these schemes into being just a coincidence?
Or are these people realising that they're in for a serious good-hiding come the next elections and are frantically back-pedalling?
Sid (27/06/2008 at 13:57)
Claude Warbeck, Bolton (27/06/2008 at 14:04)
Ministry of Truth Spokesman (formerly MC Spanner) (27/06/2008 at 14:09)
OR
"Every year the city council makes lots of decisions many of which have far more impact on our citizens lives than the proposed congestion charge"
Make your mind up Dicky. It's important or it isn't
You are right Orb. They know this is as welcome as the Window tax
Jay B, oldham (27/06/2008 at 14:24)
I voted for you and this is all you can come up with? There are alot of people who'll be effected by this charge too who are normal working class oldhamers. so why are you ignoring us and supporting it?
And mr leese! we wanted a referendum from the start. none of this consultation rubbish! it might have been a bit cheaper then.
Electoral Commission shouldn't be an advisor. they should be incharge to keep tings fair! i sense a fair Mugabe election coming!
ace, manchester (27/06/2008 at 14:28)
Chris, Irlam (27/06/2008 at 14:29)
How true - if we are not aware 100% of what the future holds then the only sensible vote can be a NO vote.
Big Bad Bob, Worsley., Walkden (27/06/2008 at 14:31)
Is this instead off the swinging silver watch.
Mike S, Manchester (27/06/2008 at 14:33)
Someone failed GCSE maths!
alvinlwh (27/06/2008 at 14:33)
Orb the Impaler, Rochdale (27/06/2008 at 14:41)
I work in IT and am very well acquainted with government run IT projects, the ludicrous overspends and lateness.
In 2012 3 billion isn't going to even pay for the IT development and infrastructure - where's the actual money for the transport improvements going to come from?
No matter what happens - to develop a proper public transport infrastructure for Manchester is going to cost an absolute fortune - 3 billion won't even make a dent in it. London at least had the advantage that they had a proper system to start with.
Sean Corker MART, Manchester (27/06/2008 at 14:43)
(DAVE GODDARD FOR LEADER OF MANC) paul teeque (27/06/2008 at 14:49)
So as a last chance gamble leese wants to do a referendum but only if all 10 are bound thereby giving himself a 50/50 chance as opposed to the above dead in the water option.
BEFORE he does this to increase his chances he wants to fly his propagada plane over manchester and spend £3 MILLION convincing us to vote yes. Wheres the budget for the manc public to be told the other side of the story?
Uncle Buck, Burnage (27/06/2008 at 14:59)
Uncle Buck, Burnage (27/06/2008 at 15:02)
Exactly! I want to see a TV ad showing the spy cameras, the gridlock just outside the charging rings & a queue of people who can no longer afford to use the expensive new transport systems. Fat chance!
Audenshaw Bob (27/06/2008 at 16:03)
If Peel Holdings put £3m towards the anti-campaign we would have the councilors slating them for cynical self interest etc.
I don't mind losing, but I do mind an unlevel playing field using my money.
Audenshaw Bob (27/06/2008 at 16:08)
There are paralels in both situations. Why not just have a straight forward public vote. Do you want it, yes or no?
All this faff about conditional referendums is nothing short of something we condemn other countries for.
Tony North-Hearn, Stockport (27/06/2008 at 16:42)
http://www.manchester.gov.uk/blog/leadersblog/post/195/submitComment
(DAVE GODDARD FOR LEADER OF MANC) paul teeque (27/06/2008 at 17:30)
I think the MEN gives more of a pro charge stance and don't agree with future transports comments on there!
Malcolm Amer, Urmston (27/06/2008 at 18:12)
In the know (27/06/2008 at 19:54)
First there is no chance of a referendum and then there is.
The new leader of the GMPTA is against the scheme.
It is also becoming clear if some Council’s choose not to accept the Toll tax the other Council’s can do nothing about it. It would seem the whole idea was dead in the water a long time ago when some Council’s pulled out yet more and more money keeps getting throw at the whole stupid idea.
How can it be progressed knowing that there isn’t unanimous support for the scheme?
Why hasn’t the MEN been asking this very question?
All other points of view are irrelevant until this addressed.
jj openminded (27/06/2008 at 20:09)
shayla (27/06/2008 at 20:16)
They are clutching at straws and desperately trying to persuade us to vote for the charge as they need the money.
I wouldn't trust them as far as I could kick them.
No. we don't want congestion charge, stop this farce and STOP WASTING OUR MONEY!
If you had put as much effort into sorting public transport and congestion as trying to grab our money, even you would realise we don't need it. You thought it was a quick fix, well you are wrong.
Think of all the inventions that were founded in Manchester, we are not thick ! I'm a Manc. and proud of it, I won't be taken advantage off !
Now sling it!
rammylad, ramsbottom (27/06/2008 at 21:20)
Thanks
Margie Taylor (27/06/2008 at 23:51)